A couple buying their first home spent $660 for mold testing. The roof over the garage had leaked, and there was dark fuzzy growth on a 2-foot by 2-foot area of drywall. Their mold testing and remediation company recommended immediate remediation… At an additional cost of $1500.
How much of this cost was needed? None of it. The buyers could have better used the money to buy a bucket and a sponge. They would have had ample funds left to repair their roof.
Growth that looks like mold is generally mold. Damp drywall is a perfect growth medium. Mold cannot grow without water, but any organic material that stays wet is likely to grow mold. There is no need for lab tests to confirm that mold is indeed mold.
I was shocked to hear the buyers paid $100/sample for lab tests. The lab I generally use for mold has a list price of $35/sample. My price (as a regular client) is $19/sample. The company in question made an unreasonable profit on testing.
The company also did not educate the buyers that to control mold, they must control moisture. If moisture is controlled, mold will not grow. If the water leak is not fixed, mold will re-grow after remediation.
Was professional remediation necessary? Not in this case. EPA recommends professional remediation for mold growth of 10 square feet or more. The moldy area in the buyer’s garage was about 4 square feet. They could have safely cleaned it themselves.
Should homeowners be wary of companies that do both testing and remediation? Absolutely! A testing company that also does remediation will often recommend additional work. Many regulatory agencies require “third party testing”, and homeowners should consider doing the same.
Is mold testing ever necessary? Sometimes it is a good idea. EPA recommends mold testing after large-scale remediation. An ERMI test can provide useful information to a physician diagnosing a health problem. But it most cases, a homeowner can identify mold as well as a professional.
Mold photo courtesy of EPA and Terry Brennan.
Mold Testing Chicanery:
I do not know the entire circumstances in this case but am not sure the author has all the facts either. When I go into project that is as a Environmental Investigator, I walk in with at least $30.000 dollars worth of equipment. I also walk in with 15 years of field experience. after the use of Infrared Photography, Moister meters ,particle counters ,air pumps ,media lap top to document everything done.i.e time place sample took photo’s all your notes. I then secure my samples per lab protocols then I express mail to the lab. Then I return to the office and prepare my report witch is usually 20 30 pages long with IR and digital photo’s. I then meet with the client and sit down and explain the results and recommendations. Now given all that if you break down your cost off gas, insurance, up keep of equipment, FedEx cost media witch is not all free, hours spent on the preparation and investigation and report time you might make $37 per sample.
There are bad people trying to over charge for just lab reports to be handed to them. I have busted many bad remediators and responsible for the detection and prosecution of one of the worst in Fla.
I think for you to throw all of us in the pool because of some rouge unscrupulous people is irresponsible. I am proud of my industry and support stricter licencing and Testing. next time you talk to Terry Brennen tell him I said hi.
Rick Hollister CEO, CEI, CMR
Environmental Administrators, Inc
Tallahassee Fl
Mold Testing Chicanery:
I do not know the entire circumstances in this case but am not sure the author has all the facts either. When I go into project that is as a Environmental Investigator, I walk in with at least $30.000 dollars worth of equipment. I also walk in with 15 years of field experience. after the use of Infrared Photography, Moister meters ,particle counters ,air pumps ,media lap top to document everything done.i.e time place sample took photo’s all your notes. I then secure my samples per lab protocols then I express mail to the lab. Then I return to the office and prepare my report witch is usually 20 30 pages long with IR and digital photo’s. I then meet with the client and sit down and explain the results and recommendations. Now given all that if you break down your cost off gas, insurance, up keep of equipment, FedEx cost media witch is not all free, hours spent on the preparation and investigation and report time you might make $37 per sample.
There are bad people trying to over charge for just lab reports to be handed to them. I have busted many bad remediators and responsible for the detection and prosecution of one of the worst in Fla.
I think for you to throw all of us in the pool because of some rouge unscrupulous people is irresponsible. I am proud of my industry and support stricter licencing and Testing. next time you talk to Terry Brennen tell him I said hi.
Rick Hollister CEO, CEI, CMR
Environmental Administrators, Inc
Tallahassee Fl
Yes the EPA recommends remediation if 10 Sq Ft. of
mold is present….However if the mold that is present is Stachybotrys the homeowner should not do the cleaning it should be remediated by a certified remediator.regardless of the Sq.Ft.
Yes the EPA recommends remediation if 10 Sq Ft. of
mold is present….However if the mold that is present is Stachybotrys the homeowner should not do the cleaning it should be remediated by a certified remediator.regardless of the Sq.Ft.
I agree with Mr. Hollister. I also perform indoor environmental tests and consultations, much as Mr. Hollister has described in his post. What I would add is that a professional can listen and help determine what kind of test best fits the needs of the Client and their situation. There are several ways a home can be tested for mold, ERMI is but one of them. Ignorant testing and sampling of a moldy environment along with unprofessional analyses of laboratory results or a water-damaged situation can be dangerous and lead to more problems. It is better to get the job done right the first time (by both the independent Indoor Environmental Professional and the Microbial Remediator). Having a professional consultant that will not only investigate but consult you through a situation should empower you to move forward with your trained Microbial Remediator at not only wiping away mold from a surface, but removing it from the surface and air without causing more harm with chemicals and disruption of microbes into the air. I would warn the author of getting too general with something that has too many variables for their black and white reporting.
I agree with Mr. Hollister. I also perform indoor environmental tests and consultations, much as Mr. Hollister has described in his post. What I would add is that a professional can listen and help determine what kind of test best fits the needs of the Client and their situation. There are several ways a home can be tested for mold, ERMI is but one of them. Ignorant testing and sampling of a moldy environment along with unprofessional analyses of laboratory results or a water-damaged situation can be dangerous and lead to more problems. It is better to get the job done right the first time (by both the independent Indoor Environmental Professional and the Microbial Remediator). Having a professional consultant that will not only investigate but consult you through a situation should empower you to move forward with your trained Microbial Remediator at not only wiping away mold from a surface, but removing it from the surface and air without causing more harm with chemicals and disruption of microbes into the air. I would warn the author of getting too general with something that has too many variables for their black and white reporting.
I couldn’t agree more with Mr. Hollister.
I personally was appalled when reading this article.
I could not believe that any respected publication would print this article with out checking into the facts further.
I couldn’t agree more with Mr. Hollister.
I personally was appalled when reading this article.
I could not believe that any respected publication would print this article with out checking into the facts further.
As the writer of this post, I would draw the readers’ attention to the relevant recommendations from EPA. EPA is the appropriate authority on environmental issues.
“In most cases, if visible mold growth is present, sampling is unnecessary.”
(http://www.epa.gov/mold/preventionandcontrol.html)
“If the moldy area is less than about 10 square feet (less than roughly a 3 ft. by 3 ft. patch), in most cases, you can handle the job yourself”
(http://www.epa.gov/mold/moldcleanup.html)
“We do not believe that one needs to take any different precautions with Stachybotrys chartarum (Stachybotrys atra), than with other molds.”
(http://www.cdc.gov/mold/stachy.htm#Q12)
As for my credentials: I have a Master of Public Health from UC Berkeley, where I concentrated on industrial hygiene and exposure assessment. I am also a Certified Industrial Hygienist, the pinnacle certification for health and safety professionals.
Most mold certifications require a high school diploma. Typical mold certification courses include 16-24 hours of training.
As the writer of this post, I would draw the readers’ attention to the relevant recommendations from EPA. EPA is the appropriate authority on environmental issues.
“In most cases, if visible mold growth is present, sampling is unnecessary.”
(http://www.epa.gov/mold/preventionandcontrol.html)
“If the moldy area is less than about 10 square feet (less than roughly a 3 ft. by 3 ft. patch), in most cases, you can handle the job yourself”
(http://www.epa.gov/mold/moldcleanup.html)
“We do not believe that one needs to take any different precautions with Stachybotrys chartarum (Stachybotrys atra), than with other molds.”
(http://www.cdc.gov/mold/stachy.htm#Q12)
As for my credentials: I have a Master of Public Health from UC Berkeley, where I concentrated on industrial hygiene and exposure assessment. I am also a Certified Industrial Hygienist, the pinnacle certification for health and safety professionals.
Most mold certifications require a high school diploma. Typical mold certification courses include 16-24 hours of training.
I am sorry, but I have to correct you on that. The EPA does not have authority over indoor air quality. Their guidlines in a court of law are superceded by applicable State Standards and Regulations: such as the Texas, Lousiana, Florida, and Maryland Regulations and the IICRC S520 Standard and Reference Guide for Professional Mold Remediation. Again, get all of the facts first. We, as professionals, have to, and should; otherwise, the information we’d give and services we’d perform (much like your article) would be based on ignorance and be a waste. I’ll give you an example: Say John Doe has five square feet of visible mold growth on his drywall in his basement. It isn’t black so he says, ‘what the heck – I can clean it up myself.’ Only to get involved and find that there is hidden mold in the wall, that (although the mold wasn’t the presupposed evil, toxic, black mold) the mold there is something he is personally sensitive toward, and that he is experiencing ill dis-ease while working on the project and there after in his home. The Standards have procedures in place and guidance on responsibilities of “independent Indoor Environmental Professionals” and the Microbial Remediators within them to help prevent these types of situations. Following the advise of your article no one would know that. I’m sorry, but you aren’t fully informed and this is a poorly developed article that can potentially harm someone if taken as gospel.
I am sorry, but I have to correct you on that. The EPA does not have authority over indoor air quality. Their guidlines in a court of law are superceded by applicable State Standards and Regulations: such as the Texas, Lousiana, Florida, and Maryland Regulations and the IICRC S520 Standard and Reference Guide for Professional Mold Remediation. Again, get all of the facts first. We, as professionals, have to, and should; otherwise, the information we’d give and services we’d perform (much like your article) would be based on ignorance and be a waste. I’ll give you an example: Say John Doe has five square feet of visible mold growth on his drywall in his basement. It isn’t black so he says, ‘what the heck – I can clean it up myself.’ Only to get involved and find that there is hidden mold in the wall, that (although the mold wasn’t the presupposed evil, toxic, black mold) the mold there is something he is personally sensitive toward, and that he is experiencing ill dis-ease while working on the project and there after in his home. The Standards have procedures in place and guidance on responsibilities of “independent Indoor Environmental Professionals” and the Microbial Remediators within them to help prevent these types of situations. Following the advise of your article no one would know that. I’m sorry, but you aren’t fully informed and this is a poorly developed article that can potentially harm someone if taken as gospel.
Additionally, there are higher degrees of learning than a 16 – 24 hour course both in trade associations like the American Indoor Air Quality Council and the American Industrial Hygiene Association, as well as colleges across American, such as Environmental Safety & Health or Environmental Health B.S. degrees. Again, you don’t have all of the facts.
Additionally, there are higher degrees of learning than a 16 – 24 hour course both in trade associations like the American Indoor Air Quality Council and the American Industrial Hygiene Association, as well as colleges across American, such as Environmental Safety & Health or Environmental Health B.S. degrees. Again, you don’t have all of the facts.
I must agree with the professionals also. I am a Biologist and have been conducting moisture assessments and mold inspections for a few years. If we conducting our inspections and consulting based upon what the EPA dictated we would likely all end up in jail, blamed for numerous health related illnesses and allergies from our clients. In the case you presented, I agree that removing a 2′ x 2′ section of drywall removal in a non-living space probably wouldn’t hurt anybody. However in a living space, i.e: a nursery! less than 10 sq ft. could cause a significant air quality problem and cause serious health effects especially young children, the elderly and immune compromised individuals. You can list all the acronyms and qualifications you want but that doesn’t mean that you know anything about mold and the mycotoxins than can sometimes produce. My brother for example has a P.h.D in Biology and is a college professor, but he doesn’t claim to know how to consult people on handling a potential mold problem in their home. The reason there is no black and white with mold is because it is a living organism that is just as dynamic as we are and because its an allergen it does not affect everyone . You wouldn’t tell your child that even though he has peanut allergies that Daddy doesn’t get sick, so go ahead and eat the peanuts and never mind what that silly doctor. Contrary to popular belief there is no such thing as “killer mold”, however this is one of the main causes of sick building syndrome and poor indoor air quality. I cant stress enough that certifications mean very little, while I am a biologist by academic training I learned absolutely everything I know about mold by professionals in the field and hands on experience. Each home or building is unique and should be objectively inspected. Also mold testing is absolutely necessary for real estate documentations/negotiations and in a court of law, ie: tenant landlord and condo issues. I didn’t write this to attack anyone I just would hate for a homeowner to stumble across the article and think that the mold/IAQ industry had no credibility.
I must agree with the professionals also. I am a Biologist and have been conducting moisture assessments and mold inspections for a few years. If we conducting our inspections and consulting based upon what the EPA dictated we would likely all end up in jail, blamed for numerous health related illnesses and allergies from our clients. In the case you presented, I agree that removing a 2′ x 2′ section of drywall removal in a non-living space probably wouldn’t hurt anybody. However in a living space, i.e: a nursery! less than 10 sq ft. could cause a significant air quality problem and cause serious health effects especially young children, the elderly and immune compromised individuals. You can list all the acronyms and qualifications you want but that doesn’t mean that you know anything about mold and the mycotoxins than can sometimes produce. My brother for example has a P.h.D in Biology and is a college professor, but he doesn’t claim to know how to consult people on handling a potential mold problem in their home. The reason there is no black and white with mold is because it is a living organism that is just as dynamic as we are and because its an allergen it does not affect everyone . You wouldn’t tell your child that even though he has peanut allergies that Daddy doesn’t get sick, so go ahead and eat the peanuts and never mind what that silly doctor. Contrary to popular belief there is no such thing as “killer mold”, however this is one of the main causes of sick building syndrome and poor indoor air quality. I cant stress enough that certifications mean very little, while I am a biologist by academic training I learned absolutely everything I know about mold by professionals in the field and hands on experience. Each home or building is unique and should be objectively inspected. Also mold testing is absolutely necessary for real estate documentations/negotiations and in a court of law, ie: tenant landlord and condo issues. I didn’t write this to attack anyone I just would hate for a homeowner to stumble across the article and think that the mold/IAQ industry had no credibility.
The author must have struck a nerve if all these mold mitigators and testers have shown up.
I would suggest they concentrate on cleaning up the unscruplous in their own industry rather than attacking the messenger.
Gut!
Gut!
You are someone I look up to as a role model.
You made some good points there. I did a search on the topic and found most people will agree with your blog.
Rick Hollister is a con man. I know this because I was an unsatisfied customer where he was so inept he could not do the work he was hired to do, he did work that he was not contracted to do and attempted to justify not returning our money by performing work that cost him time before he was even hired. He then made threats which should have warranted him to lose his license and cheated us out of hundreds of dollars. He also has a person named ”Jason” listed on the paperwork on filings with the Florida Divisions of Corporations which makes me susicious about the person named “Jason” suddenly posting here and agreeing with Mr. Hollister. They are performing another scam right before our eyes.